360 thoughts on “Chit Chat 19Sept09

  1. Hey.. if you are referring to R, it was entertaining if anything.. I think most of us have thick skin and for those that don’t, we all stick up for the others!

  2. Does anyone have an opinion on whether Cindy could realistically get charged with perjury? I just can’t see her making it through the trial (IF there ever is one) without contradicting herself. I really feel that cindy needs to go to jail and baez must be disbarred as a condition of justice for Caylee.

  3. Although I am tripping out a little bit.. I was on earlier, left it on a page, (Casey accomplice) I believe was the title.. Came back, hit refresh, the page couldn’t be found.. More trouble??

  4. Hi Humble
    I dont know what happened but just want to say that I feel bad that anything happened to you on this blog…you have given us a place for our voice here and I will be forever grateful to you for that…its alot of hard work for you, I am sure and wanted you to know your very much appreciated 😉

  5. I think things will be good now Humble.. notice I changed my avatar?? I’ve got Scrat on the job.. He’s a certified nut chaser ya know.. 😆

  6. Hi Justme…love the avatar

    Hi Mema

    Huuge Waste…I think Cindy could be charged with many things including perjury. I just hope they charge her. I also want to say I saw your post earlier and I was lol.

  7. Justme…did you see they are draining the pond? Eoar and Mikka have kept us well informed with links on off topics. They wouldn’t admit until today they were draining the pond to look for Haleigh.

  8. Yeah Steph.. I saw it.. I posted the link last night about them searching it, but it said nothing about them draining it originally.. It originally said it was a lake also.. So it’s a pond??

  9. Hi Just me…going throught them to make sure that all nastiness is gone!

    Hey Mema! Don’t feel bad! Like Colhere said everyone has thick skin! I feel bad I forgot to move her to spam!

    I am sorry that she felt urge to come over and attack everyone! She is noe in spam!

  10. Justme…it is probably a lake…I am sorry. i did read yours too and thank you. I was real excited until this morning when they said they were not doing this because of Haleigh. They said they were looking for stolen property and I thought that was a bunch of do-do. But, then thought maybe they really are.
    I just heard them say on HLN that is was a pond and that must be were I am getting that from, lol.

  11. wftv is still saying it’s a lake.. Wesh is saying it’s a pond.. So I wonder which it is.. About the alligators, I’m not sure.. I’d say there is a possibility though.. A friend of my dads used to live down there, and he said it was nothing to wake up in the morning and have one stretched out on the porch.. EEEEEKKK.. Needless to say, he didn’t stay long.. I’m not sure exactly where he lived at down there though..

  12. I hope not Mema

    Justme I did hear this morning that is was 5 acres and about 5 feet deep which is more of a pond right?? I really don’t have a clue what the difference it, lol.

  13. Humble.. You know the funny thing about all of that crap last night.. When I came on here, and saw she was here raising trouble, I thought, “Well, she’s been kicked out of the other place”.. So I went to peek and see what was going on.. Found this post from her.. Notice I deleted the name, but you know who I’m talking about.. You can also delete this post after you read it if you want.. I don’t want it left here, if you think it will just bring more trouble.. But here’s what she wrote.. I left the date and time attached..

    September 18, 2009 at 8:34 pm

    Kim, after ECD threw a fit ove here months ago and I reponded on THAT other site about it, they threw me off (moderdation). Now, they want me back over there….what the heck is that all about? ratings? well, I won’t commit to this BS

  14. hi all Humble this is no circus and i want to thank you and everybody else for all you have done.keep up the good work for Caylee nobody else is.

  15. I do pray they will find Haleigh this weekend. I would love her to be alive…i just don’t think she is after all of this time. But, she needs to be brought home and given a proper burial.

  16. I would think they would have to have a suspect and that is what lead them to this area. I also wonder where Misty is…I would like to see her charged with child endangerment and ever parent and gaurdain that leave their children like this to go party. Of course we don’t know 100% yet if this is what she did, but I bet she did.

  17. I heard two rumors this am concerning her. but I’ve only saw each on one site. so I am not going to repeat.

    But I wonder if LE is keeping an eye on her.

  18. Hi all, the AZ Rene’e here. Just want to mention, viewing all the blogs lately for any scrap of news, I am so impressed with all the people here, their compassion for Caylee, awesome research for info for all of us. Im glad the people who are here are here, and those who have left good luck to them finding contentment on other sites. Most of the moderater/Blog authors have good info in thier own style and their own opinions. Im always welcome here, can share my thoughts with sometime debate but never hatred or intolerance. Positive things arent said enough. Thanks Humble and all who contribute their precious time and energy to justice for Caylee!!!

  19. Amen Steph, I think instead of focusing on new laws for people who hurt and kill children, we need to focus on the earlier crime of endangerment and neglect. It seems this leads to the more serious cases we see lately.

  20. comparing the two cases, casey was arrested for neglect, after stating she was the last to see Caylee. and lying, Misty was the last to see haliegh, and they know she knows more, and obviously, if she knows more, shes lying.

  21. I think Misty is irresponsible and as much as Ronald seemed to care about her, he has to take responsibility for this. I liked him in a backwards kind of way, but if the fight between them and her being gone for days prior etc etc is true, he had no business leaving his children with her in the midst of so much chaos. JMO.

  22. Hi Everyone!

    eoar, that’s why I think she should have already been arrested on child endangerment charges. I think they have proof that she left those two chilren alone. And to still have the little boy? That’s just unbelievable. It’s sad that him being with Misty and Ron is the “best” for him? I think Child Services had totally dropped the ball this time.

  23. Hi Gigs

    Eoar…Thank you for the rumors. I think number 2 may be true. Probably not number one. I think we would have heard about that.

    AZ…I agree with both of your posts above


  24. I do think one of the reasons they couldn’t arrest Misty for lying…many of them were sticking together until recently, but I am not sure.

  25. Once again all kinds of mitigating circumstances regardless of Mistys involvement or lack thereof ( as in leaving the kids alone). Shes 17, drug addicted parents, abused by brother, the list goes on. I dont agree with it excusing her, but imagine in how many ways the system failed Haleigh prior to her even being born. A 17 y/o quits school in 6th grade, is abused, drugs etc…and no one ever apparently cared or interceded. Vicious cycle once again.

  26. They are saying it has nothing to do with it but I think it’s really quite a coincedence that after the questioning of Misty’s brother and sil there is so much activity.

  27. Im sure the brother would turn on his own mother for a deal, and if he knew anything about Mistys involvement they got it out of him. A rat is a very specific animal to leave in a mailbox after all, only one connotation there, especially a rat with its head cut off. Im getting a sick feeling about Ron now darnit.

  28. Hey folks..

    I had read on another blog yesterday prior to going to bed that the whole dredging the pond thing was a hoax, but I guess it wasn’t!

  29. I am hear Eoar…just in and out. I can’t quit thinking about the search and praying they find Haleigh.
    I think about all the families out there that have missing loved one…especailly children and how they are never found. That has to be a never ending nightmare.

  30. the girl that was missing around here the last 5-6 weeks, was identified yesterday. her family said it was the not knowing where she was that was the worst. And your right, prayers that they find her.

  31. Eoar
    Thanks for responding OT about ronald.I didnt remember all the low down on him.When they find Haliegh i think it will be just as convoluted a case as caylees.

  32. Eyes…i think when it comes to your kids no matter how old they are, they are your babies…you are always their parents that try to make everything better and protect them. Then the thought they are out there somewhere and you are not there to bring them home to safety or for a proper burial…I don’t know how to explain it. I just know it has to be a nightmare.
    I do agree the girl you are talking about should have been national news..

    Eyes..so true.

  33. I was just having that conversation with my 34 y/o son the other day.No matter how old, through the years the problems they have and prioritys change, but the worry is still there.Even if they are adults now.

  34. I can’t help but think that Misty and/or Ron could easily be arrested on a drug charge. Why haven’t they done that? I don’t think it would cause Ron to crack…he probably feels quite at home in a jail, but I think they could bring Misty to her knees pretty easy after a few days behind bars.

  35. Hi Eyes…I meant to say hi above. Sorry.

    Hi Marsha…It is hard to believe, but it seems many of these people were sticking together and not saying much. I see they are all talking much more now, but didn’t they do that in the beginning?
    I know with the Anthony case Annie refused to answer questions and they served her a subpoena. Where they only able to do that because Casey was charged??
    I just don’t understand how people don’t come running forward when it comes to a missing child. They can’t protect their selves…that is up to us adults to do that.

  36. I see Humble was on today.I feel bad i caused her extra housecleaning.I hope all is good.♥♥

    Do we know how long they can hold ronald on the current charges? I mean i know they need to keep him while they keep looking into tips, but is there a time frame?

  37. Yep.. it does seem they are inching toward something in the Cummings case.. There are a lot of tax dollars chasing down leads in all directions.. which is a shame, because the person that may hold the key is not being 1oo percent forthcoming.. It’s kinda dumb..

  38. That’s true Stephanie, There is someone out there that knows where Misty was, who she was with and what she was doing that night. Why don’t they speak up … unless they are in as deep as she is?

  39. Marsha – I was thinking that whoever else was with Misty that night is likely an accessory or even the perp, so we won’t see them pipe up anytime soon.

  40. Hiya Colhere!
    I think having the key stone cops on board didnt help.With or without a tip, they should have had a more aggressive attitude with the extended family

  41. Colhere, that’s probaby true. Isn’t it amazing how these uneducated people can be smart enough to do this and get away for it for so long. I think eventually this will be solved, but gosh, it’s taking a long time.

  42. The can rocks..

    It’s tough to remember that folks like that are hungry for an audience. It doesn’t seem to bother them that no one finds them likeable. They choose a target and they just want to hurt.

  43. Eaor…BOMBSHELL! That is how i spell prop today too! 😉

    I am going back and forth. Making sure I get everything on the site, before I move it over!
    Yes, it will be off wordpress, and I will have more control! 🙂 Plus I can add anytype file to the site. Like here I can’t add pdf files, there I can! i can do so much more! I am a little nervous because there are problems with wordpress here!

  44. Hi everyone. Well where was that can of Troll Spray when we needed it last night? 😆 I’m glad everyone has come out of the fiasco last night unscathed and back to the business at hand. 😆

  45. I saw this house this morning with TP…thinking how they weren’t taught very well how to do that, lol.
    Not that I taught my kids…they taught me. How happy that always made us parents to go out side and see all the trees decorated, lol.

  46. LOL so i have time to go to the bathroom, and you won’t leave without me. (i’m pretty insecure, can you tell) and don’t make me run after the car either LOL

  47. Mikka
    You missed out on some HUGE lurking fees!

    Gotta run….dinner out tonite.Eoar if anything happens while im gone, hide the key under the cinderblock.And leave a light on….

  48. Yeah ecd 9 to 10 hours a day and most saturdays for the last 4 months. gotta get our guys and gals overseas their supplies… 😆 I feel like I’ve been carring it over myself

  49. Eoar…Probably so, lol.

    Mikka…I have to spend a lot of time working out in the yard tomorrow. If you would like to get some sunlight you can come help me. 🙂

  50. Steph isn’t your yard floating like mine is?
    I’ve had so much rain even last night. I need a ark if this keeps up…. past the life vest please….

  51. Mikka/Woman Whisper…Okay you keep an eye on the blog


    FU…Yes it is very wet and my grass and vines are very long from them. But it hasn’t rained today and I am hoping it won’t tonight so I can mow, edge and trim…big fun. I am just thankful while I am doing that Mikka will be here keeping an eye on the blog, lol.

  52. Sorry, no matches! LOL It is fun to laugh on this site! 🙂

    ECDeb, Did you like the spray! I laughed so hard!

    Marsha it might not be done until tomorrow, I am working it fast! What is nice is, that when you log in over there, if you log it, it is the same avatar over here, no up loading!

  53. yep, but since computer went down, i lost everything, and now don’t have the site lol (I know you guys were out changing the addy on me)

  54. I thought I saw another squirrel on this site earlier, someones avitar, love it!! Those squirrels need all the support they can get. Maybe we should each purchase a small squirrel stuffed animal and send it to the animal in jail.

  55. FU, long time no see, I hope you have eased on the hours at work. I know the feeling, along with the little one, I try to make it on here when I possibly can 😆 I make sure I make time to do so.

  56. No not yet Ct to much to do I use to lurk at work cant even find the time to do that anymore…
    But I read some every night and my 5 hour energy drink is still kicked in tonight so here I am LOL

  57. FU, that would be super, bring all the squirrels over, we need them here so we can offer them the uttermost respect and support. I’ll get some pecans to give to them, or Pinons if they like them.

  58. Steph, yeah chlry loves her movies. I’m so far behind on the movie scene, I give up and watch old movies in amazement thinking that they are new hahahaha!!!!

    FU, I can’t ever lurk at work, so I must wait.

  59. FU so super true, so many nuts in the A-family, maybe one of them should squish themselves under the car…..and let someone run it over them back and forth, back and forth.

  60. hey good evening everyone.. stephanie, eastcoastdeb, fu, eoar, ct, humble, just me, I am back from vacation in sunny south and couldnt wait to come to humbles place and see everyone…. I missed you all and the news soooooo much,,, I am shocked over misty missing, guy arrested in yale students murder, and boaz wanting all charges dropped in casey case!!!!!!!! I had NO idea of any of this til I got here… stephanie,, hehehe,, I stayed afloat for one more trip on the waters!!!! anyway, to make my long story short… HELLO ALL.

  61. It’s the most retarded thing that Bozo the Clown could do is ask to drop all the charges. It’s not the State’s fault that he is unable to produce the evidence for which they seek. He knows that he is in deep doo right now, especially with D.Casey lieing on the stand, under oath. I hope all of them get charged.
    Justice for Caylee.

  62. Anthony’s attorneys want the judge to drop the case because her defense team never got a chance to look at the scene where her daughter Caylee’s remains were found, and therefore cannot challenge the credibility of the state’s evidence.

    Excuse me, but when they found remains near the home of the Anthony’s, they hadn’t identified the remains, so why would Bozo the Jerk need to have the defense present at a crime scene? I’ve never heard of such a thing to have the defense there at the crime scene, what for? So they can contaminate it?

  63. Hi Maxi…It is so good to see you stayed afloat.
    Baez is just a big idiot…they often ask for the case to be dismissed. But, like I told Eyes…I thought this normally happens at trial after the state presents their case. I guess not.
    Did you see they are draining a pond or lake looking for Haleigh??

    CT…So very true

  64. Exactly CT. They wanted to have something else to whine and make motions about. And WHO sent someone to walk that area in the first place.

  65. Gig, I take it that they were out there around that timeframe, partying, probably smoking da’ reefer and having s*x. I’m sure WF is jealous it wasn’t her playing referee with Misti and she is jealous because she gets to be on TV, smoking her cigarettes and blowing her smoke everywhere with her white tr*sh husband. At least though her husband is real, not a blow up husband, like Geo, with chumsticks included. Well, one long arse Chumstick.

    “Bite into a slim jim”

  66. Attorney Jose Baez said that with all of the pre-trial publicity and the community’s attachment to the case that Anthony cannot get a fair trial in Orange County.

    Wasn’t it the Anthony family who requested all of the air time when they were leading the public to believe that Caylee was out there, alive? Wasn’t it WF that mentioned to SINdy that she wanted Caylee’s face out there? I’m sure deep down inside she wanted her face out there and was still blaming Caylee for what she did, on her own, with no help…until later, after the fact, then any love for Caylee went out the window, like WF tossed her out the window into the woods……

  67. Hi Gigs…they were exploring each other…at least according to the article.

    CT…not only was Caylee not identified…even if she was the defense doesn’t get to come into a crime scene. Baez and his client are not special like they think they are.

  68. ORANGE COUNTY, Fla. — Prosecutors want a transcript of George Anthony’s secret grand jury testimony that led to the first-degree murder indictment against his daughter Casey.

    George, a former detective, told investigators he recognized the unmistakable odor of a dead body in the trunk of Casey’s car when he picked it up at a wrecker service.

    Prosecutors presented the grand jury case and George is working with the defense team, so both sides likely already know a lot about the testimony, which is supposed to be secret.

  69. Gigs…You know that is what they kept saying a long time ago. Misty kept denying it and then I think he came out and admitted it, lol.

  70. CT isn’t that hippocritical. They shamelessly beg for publicity when it feeds their financial pursuits but not when it involves a little bit of inconvenience- like a dead baby. They’re disgusting.
    Hi Macarthur. Welcome. 😆

  71. My first thought was, boax wants WHICH case dropped??? the murder case where she murdered her own baby? or, the fraud charges where she stole from a friend and cleaned out here checking acct??? or the defamation case wnere she ruined zeneida fernandez gonzales’ name???? or does he want all three dropped?? he is such a fool
    hey gigwails,,,

  72. They are disgusting. Also, reading the motions, they actually referenced another blog ~ by disecting every word that is spoken while family visited her in jail and it’s because they are video/audio taped, they do not visit her and she needs the comfort of family due to the sensitive nature of a DP case.

    Whoa, really? Comfort? Did you see comfort during those early jail visits? Nah, I saw a spoiled little biotch who killed her child and wants to get off, she might get Bozo the Jerk off, but she will not get off from this.

    Justice for Caylee!!!

  73. Baez kinda fell into this case. If I remember correctly, Casey was given his name/card by another criminal when she was being booked into jail the first time.

    He obviously does not know what he is doing. Look at all of the mistakes he has made in the motions and reprimands he has received from the judge.

    He is in way over his head and is throwing anything out there in an attempt to keep his head afloat in this case. Again, a waste, a huge waste!

  74. Mcarthur…I guess we really won’t hear any news for a day or so on the draining of the pond or lake. They said it takes 2 days, but I feel like I did when they were out there searching for Caylee…Waiting for every little bit of news that they may have found her.

  75. That’s exactly what I saw too, CT. A spoiled brat who thought irregardless of her conduct, she should be permitted to skate past any consequences. I also saw half witted parents who need to face some of their own consequences.

  76. I had always feared that when they were looking for Caylee that it’s possible that alligators could have gotten to her ~ but luckily she was retrieved, no matter the manner ~ and was given somewhat a proper burial, even though it’s not fair for SINdy to wear her ashes around her neck and the whole family live off of dead baby girl. So sick, So sad, they are all very evil people.

  77. Well put, CT!

    The think a about Casey needing the comfort of her family is ridiculous. For God’s sake, she is accused of murdering her child and never cooperated with the police from the beginning.

    Next they will be asking for Casey to be moved to a setting that is less stressful for her so she can be relaxed and prepare for her trial. Maybe they will ask that she be moved to the Ritz Carlton! That, to me, is not any more ridiculous than some of the motions that have been filed!

  78. It’s also very sad to see a family behave this way, as they are retrieving eveery little bone, they are sitting at a dining table with their friends, eating crab puffs. I’m sure WF was very jealous that she didnt get to be there ~ I’m sure Bozo the Jerk stuffed a few crab puffs down his pantalones and gave them to his client. Sicko.

  79. macarthur, I wouldn’t put it past her defense freak team.

    “File a motion to put WF in a better situation”
    We need to have a more comfortable situation for our client WF. In preparation for her trial, she must have access to the internet, access to the library (to help her lawyers with law), access to a soft bed and couch, a pair of crocks, and size XXL mu-mu for her fat arse that seems to be ever growing, won’t stop growing, it’s so huge!

  80. I was working in Putnam Co. last week and made a wrong turn on my way back. I ended up in Satsuma. There is not much there from what I saw. I did see ponds (algae covered), lakes, run down trailers and a couple of sleezy bars.

  81. hi macarthur , you have good points… I bet mistys’ brother knew her drug of choice and provided it,, and the rest is history… this is sooo sad….I so wanted to find hayleigh alive in the hidden custody of crystal the non tearing bio-mom…

  82. Very well said Macarthur, East and CT

    Maxi…I so wish she was alive too, but I don’t think she is. The only thing I always had a problem with Crystal taking Haleigh…why wouldn’t she take Jr too?

    Macarthur…So being out there was it an area that might have a bunch of alligators??

  83. just crusing thru but I saw this

    Conway told News 13 the Anthonys have been communicating with Casey through letters, but they still want to be able to have a private, sit-down conversation with her.

    Conway said he felt pretty confident the motion would be granted to keep those visits sealed unless they would be used some way in trial.

    A representative with the Orange County Jail told News 13 visits are always monitored for the client’s safety. The representative added they have no intention of offering special treatment to Casey Anthony, and she would be treated like every other inmate.

    The defense also amended their request for a change of venue for the trial, adding Palm Beach or Broward counties, but lawyers said they would still prefer Miami-Dade County as their first choice.

  84. G and C cannot be mad at Casey! After all, she created a situation so they do not need to work, ride in limos, are on national tv, are in demand and the spotlight and no longer have money woes. She has created a new life for them with no more money worries.

    It is beyond my wildest imagination how they could continually support her and deny the obvious. Oh wait! Money talks!!!

  85. Steph –
    It is not a developed area – a lot of trees, brush and dirty looking water. Here in Florida, alligators are in most bodies of water. I would bet there are alligators and more there.
    I live in Central Florida 1/2 block from a lake in “civilization” and there are alligators in the lake. I will not even walk my Shih Tsu near the waters edge (not that any dogs have been snatched by gators at this lake). In other lakes, dogs and people have been attacked by gators. As a kid, I swam and skied in this lake, but no way now although people do. Most lakes here have gators.

  86. Hi Mazew and Thank you…They keep going back and forth with all of this. They have been communicating with Casey through letters. But what was it they said about their letters. I think they went through Baez. They also said they are going to start visiting her they don’t care what Beaz says. Lyons agrees and they should visit. We are now back to them wanting private visits…that is such b.s.

  87. CT – let’s hope not! Like I mentioned earlier today, I will be livid if she walks on a technicality. I will totally lose faith in our justice system.

  88. They are afraid if they visit, Casey will implicate them on the videotape. They have too much to lose. After her last tantrum, they can’t afford to anger her and have her spill the beans on the cover up.

  89. Thank you Macarthur…When looking at the pictures today of the area and hearing about gators in FL…I thought it looked like an area they would hang out in. I hope if Haleigh is there that they didn’t get her.

  90. They want video/audio blocked from their visits with their murderess daughter so that they are able to smuggle in some Skol, Trappies, jalapenos, and Chumsticks for her since she might not be able to purchase them at the jail wal-mart

  91. She won’t walk…it seems they have been very careful with the handling of the evidence. They also have been overly patient with the rest of the family

  92. Again these folks’ arrogance – thinking they should be above the law and thinking they are entitled to special treatment is sickening. If they aren’t discussing something incriminating, then why would the Anthonys have a problem with the visits being recorded?

  93. Steph – I hope the gators don’t get her, as well. The waters I saw were boggy looking, nasty.
    Local news here is saying they are looking for evidence in the pond and drained the pond to facilitate the search and for the safety of the searchers.

  94. They know better than to mess with the evidence. The prosecution is not stupid, they are probably much more experienced than that Bozo the Jerk-Brain. Bozo got the case thrown in his lap. He needs to go back to where he came from, after this he will still have the smirk on his face; providing services to his clients, in a first class manner; just like he did/does for WF. You know with those rides to-from his office when she was out on bond. Maybe they too played the sunglasses game in his office, I’m sure she changed into her referee suit when she got there, so he could sniff up the skirt. Then pass out.

  95. CT – They want video/audio blocked from their visits so they can all get their stories straight once and for all!!! Maybe explore some ideas on how they can make more money, market their stories to a better paying audience. Planning their future lives of luxury all at the expense of Caylee. These people have absolutely no scruples.

  96. I don’t think it will ever be possible to get their stories straight, they’ve already caught themselves in many situations where their story changed, they are not credible, they are murderess cover-uppers.

    SINdy with her draggin’ ta’tas that tubie loves so much. He begs her for them all the time. Mallory gets mad.

  97. stephanie, you are right,,, crystal would have taken them both!!!! I think I was in denial… this poor baby is dead, and it is just sooo sad..
    I cannot even begin to see a scenario that allows casey anthony to go free, or even to enjoy special treatment in jail or prison…… I hope the defence gets over this notion…..it just cannot happen..

  98. Do you know what always amazed me…these people trying to get their stories straight. They spent sooooo very much time together and they still couldn’t keep their stories straight. You would think with at least Caylee’s father they would have sat down and said…Okay this is who he is and about the situation and we are going to stick to it…they couldn’t even all tell the same story about him.

  99. LOL CT. I don’t think they can ever resolve their lies either. There are just too many and none make any sense. They are ridiculous.

  100. gigs – agreed!

    They seem to have no problem spilling all to the world via the media. No one else in jail is afforded special privilege. WF is incarcerated. No special privs!

    On C&G’s love of media, as gross as it is, LE likely monitors each statement and could use statements in trial. They are infamous for contradiction..

  101. IMO, the State must be patient with C & G and cannot hold them accountable for their lies at this point in time by pressing charges against them. This is so they will be able to testify during Casey’s trial and not plead the 5th.

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